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Let talk about the draft  

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buckaroo
(@buckaroo)
Draft Prospect
Joined: 6 months ago
Posts: 10
06/20/2020 8:24 pm  
Posted by: @willhoo99
Posted by: @buckaroo
Posted by: @mackie_lundquist

Alonzo Richardson looks really interesting. Anyone know where he would have gone in a traditional 40 round draft?

whodat??

Richardson is a two-way prep player signed Friday evening. He was a San Diego St commit. 17.7yo 5'11, 160. SS and RHP. very good defender with plus speed. FB sits low 90s and CB is abv avg. 4 pitch mix.

Richardson was probably a post 10 round pick. He was not rated in any top 500. Very athletic, quick armed SS and RHP.  I'll more info up on him sometime soon. 

Sounds like someone worth watching at the very least.  If we ever have baseball again, that  is.  😟 


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DetDawg
(@detdawg)
Low-A dreamer
Joined: 5 months ago
Posts: 211
06/20/2020 9:49 pm  

Very young for his class and seems to have some tools and ceiling, particularly as a 2-way player whose performance could jump once he focuses on 1 position.  I'm a bit surprised he would take $20K now rather than spend a couple of years in college.


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Tondo
(@tondo)
Rookie League baller
Joined: 6 months ago
Posts: 25
06/21/2020 12:37 pm  

Here are two free event reports about Richardson from PG:

Alonzo Richardson (2020, Spring Valley, Calif.) is a talented two-way player committed to San Diego State, and in addition to his prowess as a middle infielder, he’s intriguing on the mound. He came on in relief of Blawn in this game, picking up the final five outs of the game by CBA. The arm speed and physical projection on his lean build both stand out, and he ran his fastball up to 90 mph in this outing. That physical projection and arm speed give him a pretty significant velocity ceiling, and given his athleticism and other tools, could end up a high-end two-way player in college. He also picked up two hits in this game, further showing that two-way ability.

 

– Brian Sakowski

On the other side of the bag was Richardson who is the 13th-ranked shortstop in California and a San Diego State commit. He turned in a defensive performance for the ages and he too features some advance defensive actions. The separator for the future Aztec is his high-motor mentality, twitch and his flinch breaks, which are outstanding leading him to exceptional first-step reads and jumps. These reads and jumps lead to three gold standard plays. In the top of the first, he ranged to his glove side and snagged a line drive going full extension, and also replicated the play going deep in the 5-6 hole in the fifth. He showed the full repertoire of defensive skills on a play up the middle in the third when he ranged to his glove side, picked the ball on a short hop and displayed great body control and use of arm slot to finish the play on the run, showcasing his arm strength

 


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Tondo
(@tondo)
Rookie League baller
Joined: 6 months ago
Posts: 25
06/21/2020 12:54 pm  

Indians now have to find playing time for G. Rodriguez, Sanquintin, A. Martinez, Y. Valdes, Cairo, C. Tucker, Tolentino, J. Brown and now A. Richardson in rookie ball. That's 9 players plus J. Lara and D. Frias who should come stateside and play in the AZL.

And there's a similar logjam above in A/A+ without a team in Mahoning Valley. Bracho, Rocchio, Fermin, R. Delgado, R. Palacios, M. Gonzalez, Tena, V. Nova, J. Lopez

Richardson was a great UDFA signing, but it makes the Tolentino pick even more superfluous. They love MIF, but it doesn't make any developmental sense to pile on. I'd like to see them put their energy towards signing a couple of young arms or corner position players. Not a lot of young talent at those positions in AZL and it's why I preferred a HS arm over yet another SS project in Tucker at 23 overall. 


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DetDawg
(@detdawg)
Low-A dreamer
Joined: 5 months ago
Posts: 211
06/21/2020 3:22 pm  

Can't disagree that the surplus of MIFs will likely impact development of more that one player.  I think the only way that won't happen is if one or more of these MIFs is included in a multi-player trade.


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Mackie_Lundquist
(@mackie_lundquist)
Draft Prospect
Joined: 5 months ago
Posts: 15
06/21/2020 3:46 pm  
Posted by: @tondo

Indians now have to find playing time for G. Rodriguez, Sanquintin, A. Martinez, Y. Valdes, Cairo, C. Tucker, Tolentino, J. Brown and now A. Richardson in rookie ball. That's 9 players plus J. Lara and D. Frias who should come stateside and play in the AZL.

And there's a similar logjam above in A/A+ without a team in Mahoning Valley. Bracho, Rocchio, Fermin, R. Delgado, R. Palacios, M. Gonzalez, Tena, V. Nova, J. Lopez

Richardson was a great UDFA signing, but it makes the Tolentino pick even more superfluous. They love MIF, but it doesn't make any developmental sense to pile on. I'd like to see them put their energy towards signing a couple of young arms or corner position players. Not a lot of young talent at those positions in AZL and it's why I preferred a HS arm over yet another SS project in Tucker at 23 overall. 

Right now the Valdes and Cairo draft picks remain colossal head scratchers. They seemed like bizarre picks at the time-and now they seem absurd. Probably the only time in the last five or six years I was disappointed on the day of the draft with our choices.

 


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Tondo
(@tondo)
Rookie League baller
Joined: 6 months ago
Posts: 25
06/21/2020 4:50 pm  

They already invest most of their IFA budgets on MIF, year after year. Why double down and do the same in drafts? This was a pitching heavy class with a lot of high upside HS arms. My dream draft was Bitsko and Kelley in round 1 and one of Santos/Hence in 2nd or any 3 of those 4. It was there for the taking. It would have been like Espino/Hankins/Torres talent all in one draft.

It looks like Bitsko is going to sign in the 3 to 3.5M range and that's what Tucker+Tolentino will come out at combined. I'm pretty sure those two will never be enough in a trade for Bitsko. Was getting Tolentino really worth passing on Bitsko or Kelley? That's the value equation.

Bitsko, Burns, Halpin, Bedell, Raya, Hickman is my hindsight draft


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Willie Hood
(@willhoo99)
Member Moderator
Joined: 7 months ago
Posts: 187
06/21/2020 7:51 pm  

@tondo

I've heard Bitsko's price was $3.5M. Idk, if that's true, but the Ray's saved a little at 37.

I'm curious to see what Wilcox gets. Though there is a rumor he has a deal with the Padres for $3.3M.

The Indians seem content to develop Richardson as a 2 way player for now. They told him to keep working out as both. He's a qlty fielder but I think he lacks the power to drive the ball. His arm is quick and smooth and as he gets stronger he should add more velocity. He was more 90-92, t93 and I can see mid-90's with a some potential for a plus CB. He also has a SL and CH too. 

My guess he never wanted to go to school and is keeping future options open by being a 2 way player. Either way, he gets a full ride and a minimal signing bonus. He seems like a kid that may have been somewhere in the 5-7 range (maybe better) in a few years.

They've invested heavily in the MIF spot. I find it intriguing and odd they've doubled down there in recent years. Even in the IFA period will bring in a pair of high caliber players in Angel Genao and Fran Audley plus several more MIF. It was good to see them veer ever so slightly with the agreement in place for C Robert Lopez.


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GSon
 GSon
(@gson)
Rookie League baller
Joined: 6 months ago
Posts: 41
06/22/2020 6:56 am  

The choices taken in the draft and undrafted free agents have added to the glut of middle infielders in the tribe's system.. Historical thinking has been that the most athletic & most capable players are usually shortstops.. So, taking another SS becomes directly in tuned to taking the Best Player Available... The Indians FO and player personnel have been opposed to taking a position of need (catchers, corners, LHRP's), & continue to take the BPA.. this is their path... 

If you were to ask learned baseball talent evaluators about the Indians draft.. they are thrilled with the talent acquired but would suggest more diversity would help the system, overall, whereas the Indians brass believe making the system better is a collateral benefit of taking the BPA.. 

It's easy to like Carson Tucker and Milan Tolentino and Petey Halpin.. these are talented and interesting selections. The addition of Allen, Burns & Hickman are the kind of picks that the Tribe is famous for.. 

...probably.. 


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DetDawg
(@detdawg)
Low-A dreamer
Joined: 5 months ago
Posts: 211
06/22/2020 9:24 am  

@gson

I understand the strategy, particularly as it applies to Latin players.  But, IMO it's no longer sustainable at a time when the number of minor league affiliates are contracting - unless the developmental plan is to effectuate position changes at the start of some of these players' careers, whether it be CF, 2B, 3B, or some other position.


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GSon
 GSon
(@gson)
Rookie League baller
Joined: 6 months ago
Posts: 41
06/22/2020 11:59 am  
Posted by: @detdawg

@gson

I understand the strategy, particularly as it applies to Latin players.  But, IMO it's no longer sustainable at a time when the number of minor league affiliates are contracting - unless the developmental plan is to effectuate position changes at the start of some of these players' careers, whether it be CF, 2B, 3B, or some other position.

Several players drafted at middle infielders have been moved to a position that gives them a chance to advance to the highest levels of baseball (read: succeed). Aaron Bracho, Gabriel Rodriquez, and Yu Chang, as examples were all drafted as SS's and are playing most of their games at another spot.. Each of these (and other guys) have the ability to play more than one position.. but  project as something other at the ML level. (Aaron Bracho as a 2B could become the best player he can be at that spot and only marginally acceptable as a ML SS).

 

The contracting of the minors has only been discussed for few months & has yet to be implemented.. All of these draftees haven't seen the effect. There may be a deeper focus on versatility in the coming years if the minors are contracted to the extent being discussed.. That means MORE SS's selected rather than fewer, imho..

 

You cannot beat versatile and capable athletes in this situation.. and the Indians forward looking FO and player personnel development staff.. know this as well as ANYONE. I could even see a second version of player development to begin to take foothold.. The DriveLine-like Created/Engineered players could become the best source of the best/most durable players. This will be akin to the Area 1 and Area 2 of the Hunger Games whereby kids will be supported by an organization that pays for that athlete to train full time from the time they're born to the ripe age of 18 while under advanced training methods and instruction until they are of the age to be made available to ML teams. It's coming.. perhaps within the next decade..

 

Thoughts?..


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Mackie_Lundquist
(@mackie_lundquist)
Draft Prospect
Joined: 5 months ago
Posts: 15
06/22/2020 4:13 pm  
Posted by: @gson
Posted by: @detdawg

@gson

I understand the strategy, particularly as it applies to Latin players.  But, IMO it's no longer sustainable at a time when the number of minor league affiliates are contracting - unless the developmental plan is to effectuate position changes at the start of some of these players' careers, whether it be CF, 2B, 3B, or some other position.

Several players drafted at middle infielders have been moved to a position that gives them a chance to advance to the highest levels of baseball (read: succeed). Aaron Bracho, Gabriel Rodriquez, and Yu Chang, as examples were all drafted as SS's and are playing most of their games at another spot.. Each of these (and other guys) have the ability to play more than one position.. but  project as something other at the ML level. (Aaron Bracho as a 2B could become the best player he can be at that spot and only marginally acceptable as a ML SS).

 

The contracting of the minors has only been discussed for few months & has yet to be implemented.. All of these draftees haven't seen the effect. There may be a deeper focus on versatility in the coming years if the minors are contracted to the extent being discussed.. That means MORE SS's selected rather than fewer, imho..

 

You cannot beat versatile and capable athletes in this situation.. and the Indians forward looking FO and player personnel development staff.. know this as well as ANYONE. I could even see a second version of player development to begin to take foothold.. The DriveLine-like Created/Engineered players could become the best source of the best/most durable players. This will be akin to the Area 1 and Area 2 of the Hunger Games whereby kids will be supported by an organization that pays for that athlete to train full time from the time they're born to the ripe age of 18 while under advanced training methods and instruction until they are of the age to be made available to ML teams. It's coming.. perhaps within the next decade..

 

Thoughts?..

I don't disagree with your analysis, but I still don't understand the Valdes and Cairo picks in 2019. These guys are no better than four or five of the international teenager shortstops they have signed, not to mention Freeman and others in the system, and Cairo and Valdes either play SS or they fail. They are not guys who have bats that project to the corners. Even in the reports it pegged these guys who may make it, at best, as utility guys and banjo hitters. Really? Blow a 2nd and 3rd round pick on this? Draft a catcher or a power hitter then, or a college pitcher. With high picks shoot for a stud. We have no shortage of guys whose downside is they end up as utility infielders who can't hit.

 


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GSon
 GSon
(@gson)
Rookie League baller
Joined: 6 months ago
Posts: 41
06/22/2020 7:32 pm  
Posted by: @mackie_lundquist
Posted by: @gson
Posted by: @detdawg

@gson

I understand the strategy, particularly as it applies to Latin players.  But, IMO it's no longer sustainable at a time when the number of minor league affiliates are contracting - unless the developmental plan is to effectuate position changes at the start of some of these players' careers, whether it be CF, 2B, 3B, or some other position.

Several players drafted at middle infielders have been moved to a position that gives them a chance to advance to the highest levels of baseball (read: succeed). Aaron Bracho, Gabriel Rodriquez, and Yu Chang, as examples were all drafted as SS's and are playing most of their games at another spot.. Each of these (and other guys) have the ability to play more than one position.. but  project as something other at the ML level. (Aaron Bracho as a 2B could become the best player he can be at that spot and only marginally acceptable as a ML SS).

 

The contracting of the minors has only been discussed for few months & has yet to be implemented.. All of these draftees haven't seen the effect. There may be a deeper focus on versatility in the coming years if the minors are contracted to the extent being discussed.. That means MORE SS's selected rather than fewer, imho..

 

You cannot beat versatile and capable athletes in this situation.. and the Indians forward looking FO and player personnel development staff.. know this as well as ANYONE. I could even see a second version of player development to begin to take foothold.. The DriveLine-like Created/Engineered players could become the best source of the best/most durable players. This will be akin to the Area 1 and Area 2 of the Hunger Games whereby kids will be supported by an organization that pays for that athlete to train full time from the time they're born to the ripe age of 18 while under advanced training methods and instruction until they are of the age to be made available to ML teams. It's coming.. perhaps within the next decade..

 

Thoughts?..

I don't disagree with your analysis, but I still don't understand the Valdes and Cairo picks in 2019. These guys are no better than four or five of the international teenager shortstops they have signed, not to mention Freeman and others in the system, and Cairo and Valdes either play SS or they fail. They are not guys who have bats that project to the corners. Even in the reports it pegged these guys who may make it, at best, as utility guys and banjo hitters. Really? Blow a 2nd and 3rd round pick on this? Draft a catcher or a power hitter then, or a college pitcher. With high picks shoot for a stud. We have no shortage of guys whose downside is they end up as utility infielders who can't hit.

 

IDK much/anything really about Valdez and Cairo.. Neither seems to be well thought of or bring much.. Perhaps someone who has seen them play could help with why they were chosen..  I do know those picks at # 63 and #130 were void of what I'll call hot names.. these guys are still too unknown to label them banjo hitters.. but.. they may be..


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DetDawg
(@detdawg)
Low-A dreamer
Joined: 5 months ago
Posts: 211
06/26/2020 8:40 pm  

The Indians reportedly sign 1st Rd pick Carson Tucker for $2 million, the amount he was said to have agreed to at the time of his selection.

https://twitter.com/ByRobertMurray/status/1276666573697085441


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DetDawg
(@detdawg)
Low-A dreamer
Joined: 5 months ago
Posts: 211
06/26/2020 10:46 pm  

The Indians have also signed LHP Logan Allen (2nd rd) and RHP Mason Freeman (5th rd).

https://twitter.com/tribeinsider/status/1276690418877554689


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